"Sometimes, no matter what you do, you won’t get anything right; and other times, no matter what you do, everything you touch will turn to gold." Yogendra Patel
Today, I am joined once again by one of my buddies, Rupal Patel. Rupal is her own words 'living the dream' as a writer, professional speaker and advisor to founders, leaders and corporate teams. But it hasn't always been that way, which we kind of unpick in our meandering conversation.
I'd also like to share a quote that Rupal's father, Yogendra Patel, shared with her when she was younger: "Sometimes, no matter what you do, you won’t get anything right; and other times, no matter what you do, everything you touch will turn to gold.". This is so true of life in general and of the entrepreneur, investor and all-round striving-for-success-person, as I'm sure you'd agree.
We talk about a range of topics, unplanned and unscripted, as is usually the case when we get together. Do we get a software plugin that enables us to suddenly smash through those glass ceilings or be self-compassionate when we let our focus and priorities slip? Do we become an overnight success or is there perhaps a journey of personal growth, trial and error the odd means to an end route we take along the way?
I guess we kind of delve into philosophical and spiritual contemplation, as we discuss our purpose, including how it can be discovered and change over time, being in balance both personally and universally, being wholly human and the merit of measuring both return on both time and return on energy, in addition to return on investment. Oh...we also speak of being humble, grateful, having choices, still facing first-world problems, manifestation coupled with disciplined action...and so much more!
I must also not forget to mention the fact that Rupal received a proper book-publishing deal earlier this year. Her book will be published in May 22 but is available to pre-order from Amazon, which I have already done. It's called From CIA to CEO, unconventional life lessons for thinking bigger, leading better and being bolder. The struggle of how she came to write this book is worth listening to and I know it's going to be a great read, for sure.
I think we also mention property, occasionally!
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Transcription of the show
Today, I am joined once again by one of my buddies, Rupal Patel. Rupal is her own words 'living the dream' as a writer, professional speaker and advisor to founders, leaders and corporate teams. But it hasn't always been that way, which we kind of unpick in our meandering conversation.
I'd also like to share a quote that Rupal's father, Yogendra Patel, shared with her when she was younger: "Sometimes, no matter what you do, you won’t get anything right; and other times, no matter what you do, everything you touch will turn to gold.". This is so true of life in general and of the entrepreneur, investor and all-round striving-for-success-person, as I'm sure you'd agree.
We talk about a range of topics, unplanned and unscripted, as is usually the case when we get together. Do we get a software plugin that enables us to suddenly smash through those glass ceilings or be self-compassionate when we let our focus and priorities slip? Do we become an overnight success or is there perhaps a journey of personal growth, trial and error the odd means to an end route we take along the way?
I guess we kind of delve into philosophical and spiritual contemplation, as we discuss our purpose, including how it can be discovered and change over time, being in balance both personally and universally, being wholly human and the merit of measuring both return on both time and return on energy, in addition to return on investment. Oh...we also speak of being humble, grateful, having choices, still facing first-world problems, manifestation coupled with disciplined action...and so much more!
I must also not forget to mention the fact that Rupal received a proper book-publishing deal earlier this year. Her book will be published in May 22 but is available to pre-order from Amazon, which I have already done. It's called From CIA to CEO, unconventional life lessons for thinking bigger, leading better and being bolder. The struggle of how she came to write this book is worth listening to and I know it's going to be a great read, for sure.
I think we also mention property, occasionally!
Property Chatter
Hello, and welcome once again to another episode on the property voice podcast. My name is Richard Brown. And as always, it's a pleasure to have you join me, but not just me on the show again today. We're in the middle of this conversational mini series with a few more buddies, basically. And it's been great fun so far. And I am delighted to be looking forward to this next conversation because we always have a good old chat and RuPaul Patel, welcome to the property boys podcast once again. How are you?
Thank you. Thank you. Yeah, thank you so much, Richard, I'm doing really, really, really well.
You are indeed, we just had a very quick catch up before we hit record. And already I could hear some of the great things I'm sure we're gonna get into that. But we'll come back, I always love our conversations are stimulating the wide ranging, not often short, and you know, just really good fun. So it's great, great for you to be here. So um, I think, you know, just, I will be useful, you probably gone through this again, but just set the scene about where you're at right now and what you're doing a little bit, just what I know, You've changed a bit, since you first came to talk with my audience, but just sort of a bit of a recap. And then we may be able to plug those gaps and see what how that happened.
That sounds great. To put it very simply, I'm effectively living my dream. So for a long time now, I knew and tried to find ways to do a lot more writing professionally, as well as doing a lot more speaking professionally and to bigger audiences. And for least the past two years, I've been able to do a lot more writing and speaking and the main focus of my work now are those two things. So writing, I've got a book coming out in a few months time. And then yeah, it's exciting. And then also the speaking, I've been really just doing some wonderful speaking engagements for corporates, for large companies, big conferences, but also small teams and that kind of thing. And so those are two of the big three pillars of what I'm doing at the moment. So there's the speaking, there's the writing, and then also, I'm doing a lot of advisory and leadership work. So that's working with founders leaders. You know, sometimes it's corporate teams, sometimes it's just individuals. But really, the fundamental thread in that work is just helping people unlock their potential and get out of their own way.
Yep. And you know, we've had lots of conversations, I can vouch for you being able to help people get out of their own way, when you've helped me sometimes get out of my own way. So it's, I'm sure you've got that, but the writing of the speaking this just go back there. And by the way, because people will be going, hang on a minute. Didn't you have a report on the women in property? Series not too long ago, and I didn't hear the word property. Yeah. The three pillar? Yeah. So if you want to pick that,
yeah, sure. I mean, for me, and this may have come up in one of our many conversations, Richard, but for me property was often what it was very, very concretely, for me a means to an end in the sense that I knew when I first got started in property, that one of the things I wanted to get out of it, in addition to creating beautiful homes, providing, you know, really high standard accommodation, and homes and all that great stuff. I knew it would, or I wanted it to help me buy back my own time, because I knew I was going to be one of those portfolio career people or, you know, someone who had a lot of different strings to their bow. And I just didn't know what the next thing was, but I knew there was going to be a next thing. And so I still am very actively involved in my property business or our property business. But it's no longer the bulk of where I'm focusing and investing my time in my efforts. It's something that we've systemized operationalized in a lot of ways to require a lot less day to day input from me. And while going on that journey of building and scaling our property business, I started to gravitate more and more towards the things that people were asking me to do informally. So I got so many requests for, you know, mentorship where people would ask me questions or send me emails and I found that I loved helping other people with the expertise that was property specific that I was gaining, and always increasing but also with some of the bigger picture mindset related things that are true across the board, in business and in life. And as I did more and more of that work, I started to see well actually I love seeing the transformation I can help achieve another They're people. And I want to find a way to do that with more of my time. And so that's sort of how that shift started to happen. It happened very organically through my property work, but then I consciously chose to focus more and more on it, and then not just work with people in property, but work with founders work with other leaders. And now it's, you know, literally companies and people with within organisations across all sectors and properties, just one small part of it.
Yeah, exactly. Well, thanks for, you know, filling in the pieces there or joining those dots. Yeah, I think, you know, I think so, a lot of people think, you know, they have, they have to love probably, to get involved in property. And it's, you just said kind of it was a means to an end, right? It was the ROI, which let you get to an R O T, you know, so your time, so from return investment, to return on time, a lot of people talk about financial freedom, which property is an obvious, you know, one of the obvious ways, not the only one that you can realise that achieve that. But you talked, you talked about time freedom. Yeah. And I think so many, a lot of people I'm speaking to as well, I talked about that time freedom, and more that it's a means to an end. And the end is the time freedom, so they can do what they want with that time. Yeah, and in your case, speaking, writing, you know, corporate advisory or individual leadership advisory has become you know, the thing you want to do with your time by the sound of it, so
thank you. Thank you. Yeah, I mean, it's all very exciting. And I think, you know, everything we do can serve a purpose. And that's one of the things that I think often trips people up is that they think that their career or their marriage, or their hobbies have to have a specific and all consuming meaning. But sometimes it's just one thing, you know, your career can be the defining thing about you, or it can just be a thing that you do, that then enables you to fund what defines you or what you want to define yourself. And so, property can be many things for some people, you know, it is the end of itself, they love property, they love, you know, everything about it. For others, it is a means to a different end. And for others, it's some something in between. And I think, fair enough, you know, as long as you're acting with integrity, and with high standards and good values, then it's okay, that it isn't what one thing doesn't become the be all end all of your existence, or your you know, self worth or your self identity or anything like that. And it can just play a part in the bigger picture of your life.
Yeah, there's a couple of images coming into my mind as you're talking and I'm hearing you, the patchwork quilt is sort of definitely, you know, that one that springs to mind. And I think, you know, we were multi dimensional, we've, you know, hopefully got a little bit more interest or, or interests about as then, you know, being you know, just about this or that the other. And I think sometimes if we peg ourselves to a certain outcome, what happens when we get that outcome? You know, we can find ourselves, you know, a little bit floundering. Maybe I had someone come talk to me or we, we bought a business recently. So that's part of my migration. And yeah, I was kind of nudged along to talk about my wider purpose. You're going this, this episode will follow the one I did with Kami, by the way. And so it was Kim even kind of pushed me and said, right, then rigid what that plan can share your personal vision. I kind of wasn't, you know, wasn't kind of ready for it. Anyway, I did. And it was obviously from the heart because I hadn't scripted anything. Yeah. And someone came, a couple of people came up afterwards. And they said some nice things, which is great. But one of them actually said to me, I'm looking to find my purpose or refined, Rediscover, I think, rediscover my purpose, because I thought my purpose was my kids. Yeah. They've all grown up and left home now. Yeah. And I realised that, you know, I, you know, that was what I was living for. They were living for specifically. And now, they're kind of they're okay, they're on their own. They don't, they don't really need me, you know. So what do I do with my life? Yeah, so I think and then, obviously, going through it, I gave her a couple of pointers, I should have points or your direction by itself. I know that I gave her a couple of pointers about how to perhaps rediscover that or reconnect with it, because I think it's within all of us, but it takes some digging out and it can shift over time. 100% What do you think about that?
Yeah, no, it's funny because, um, it's something that I am also very conscious of, and, you know, have had conversations with others about and I think again, we can sometimes put too much pressure on ourselves to find our one purpose, maybe we have multiple purposes. And I, the key thing for me has always been to live a very open minded and experimental or have an experimental approach to life. And so, you know, for people like that woman who was asking you about, you know, how does she refine her purpose or find a new purpose? One of the things that I do, and I can say, from my own experience, but also from others, who I've sort of, you know, worked with on this is, just keep your eyes open, you know, if there's a small little thing that strikes your fancy, try it out, you know, if all of a sudden, you know, some people, I don't know, I'm making this totally up on the fly. But like, if you love watching Strictly Come Dancing, and you think, designate be fun, take a ballroom dancing class, right? I mean, there's so many endless possibilities that we can all pursue, but we so often stop ourselves from exploring or experimenting, because we think, Oh, but you know, I'm too old, or it's too late, or I'm going to SOC, or I don't know where this is going. And that's the whole point, you don't know where it's going. And sometimes it's just worth going on the ride, to see where it goes. And I think a really poignant example, on this sort of idea of, of just going, where to go and where it goes, is years ago, when you and I talked, after one of our many conversations, you planted the seed to me about, Hey, have you ever considered doing a podcast, and I thought, Oh, I hadn't until that second. But I thought, let me give it a go. It sounds like an interesting idea. I love having conversations with smart people and different people and folks from totally different backgrounds and industries, etc. Maybe it'll be a fun thing. I didn't then put all this pressure on myself to say, oh, but it has to be a number one best selling or, you know, highly rated podcast, and I need to get millions of downloads, and I need to find sponsors and monetize it. I just went on the ride, I started asking around, I came up with an idea for what the podcast would be generally about. But you know, I just had interesting conversations with interesting people and just took the ride for its own sake. And to this day, you know, some people listen to it. So a lot of people don't, there's been some really, really wonderful relationships, I've developed through it, some friendships that have come from it. And again, it hasn't been anything that I've ever tried to force into being more than it is, I just let it be what it is. And so if at some point, it becomes something I can monetize, great, but if not, I'm still gonna have fun having these conversations and meeting these interesting people. And I think it's similar in the bigger picture for others who are looking to find a purpose or something that excites them, I think it doesn't even have to be your life's purpose. It can just be something that keeps your life interesting. And just explore for the sake of exploring try things do things, if you've got the luxury to do it, then by all means, just go where the ride takes you.
Absolutely. By the way, bravo, I think I'm going to send this recording to the lady. She connects with you, but I maybe I don't want to be too revealing. In the conversation that we had briefly. She, she's, she's that the environment in his office is really warm. And one of the reasons why it's warm is that there's a lot of cake. Okay, so and this particular lady is responsible for quite a lot of that cake, you know, and baking it. I mean, you know, stuff like that. And so that was one element, you know. And then the second element was she revealed to me that she's involved in her local community. I call might be a little bit wrong about this, but I think it was more elderly, in local community. And I just, I just sort of said to her, I said, maybe there's something in that cake and maybe, you know, just go with it, as you see. Maybe she's working, she has a job. But the purpose could be outside of that, of course, doesn't have to be her day job. But you know, of course, making cakes, which is you know, I think she obviously puts her love. Yeah, yeah. And then the, you know, the community element. You know, obviously, who's gonna who's gonna criticise that? Yeah. So I don't know. I'm gonna have to recap, catch up with it, because I do remember. And it did plan to go back circle back and just go has that thought process going. But you started this by saying like little seeds, wasn't it? Yeah. You said I sewed that little seed and then yes, you know, I don't want to take too much credit for that. But you know, you
should you can
get you watered it Yeah. Etc. Yeah, that was that. The other thing I was gonna say just as a bit of a random thought. heard the other day. I think I'm right in saying this. You might know Rod Stewart. I'm not saying you might know Rod Stewart. Yeah, maybe do. But Rod Stewart apparently he's got a hobby with model trains.
Yes, yes, yes. Yeah. And the great thing about it is that sorry, I'm stealing your thunder, go for it. Richard, tell me where you're going with this? Oh, no, I'm so sorry. I swear, I think the context in which I heard it was about how he's also just really mediocre. He hasn't tried to make it, this thing that he perfects, or that has taken over his life, it's just something that he does for its own sake, and for his love of doing it. And, and, and, and I guess, connecting that to sort of the question that we started sort of answering together. Sometimes that's okay. I think, again, this idea that everything has to lead somewhere, a hobby has to turn into a career or a career has to turn into a purpose, or, you know, a purpose has to turn into our life's meaning and legacy. It can, but it doesn't have to. And the great thing about as you said earlier, all of us human beings being multi dimensional and multifaceted and multi interested, is that we can tell we can be mediocre and happy at lots of different things. And, you know, Rod Stewart also played semi professional or maybe not even semi pro football, you know, he didn't turn that turn it into this desperate thing of like, oh, but now I have to, you know, be you know, become a Rangers starting, you know, starting captain or whatever. He's like, That's just something I did, because I enjoy doing it. And so, the model, the model trains thing, I think, Gosh, I wish I remembered now why?
I know where it came. Now. We know why we I know why we both know it. Because you tip me off. You've tipped me off on a couple of books recently. And the most recent one is 4000 weeks.
Yes. That's exactly where we're getting it from. Yeah, yeah, I
was. I couldn't remember what it was in the newspaper.
Yeah, thank you for remembering that. That's exactly what it was. Yeah.
No, exactly. Right. And if I actually that's a really good book, thank you for the recommendation, my pleasures, they flips the whole idea of like time hacking and productivity on its head, and it really talks about what is important. Yeah. And you've just summarise it. So well, I don't need to really reiterate, it doesn't have to be a big deal. Yes. Your deal?
Yeah. Exactly. Exactly. And to give yourself the luxury to also change, what's the big deal, or what's a little deal in your life, and that's okay, you know, again, like maybe going full circle, like, one thing doesn't have to be everything, you know, you can get emotional satisfaction from one thing, physical, you know, and sort of, well being satisfaction from something else, professional and intellectual self satisfaction for others, like, we can create these hodgepodge as of, of where we're getting our sensitive filament, and it's okay to do it that way.
Yeah, that reminds me of John, Dr. John Demartini. There, because he always talks about, we're always in balance with challenging support, in particular, he was talking about, but we're always in balance. And he went on to say, so is it there's always an equilibrium, otherwise saying balance on it, or whatever. And if you feeling you know, you, you've got a particular relationship or scenario or situation where you're a bit too stretched, and you haven't quite got the support? Well, he's basically saying in your wider life, you will get compensated with support, perhaps elsewhere. So you don't always look for equilibrium or balance in one place, or the one relationship. And I think that's really important. That's one thing I wanted to bring up. And the second thing, you know, you'll have a lot of wisdom to add to this. The second thing is about change. And so funnily enough, there's somebody recently who, there was a recent acquisition and the role that they had was already starting to change. And then we identified it probably needs to change a bit more. And there was there was struggling, and they couldn't initially cope with that. And actually, though, after a lot of wrestling and struggle, and possibly thinking it was an external issue, that person turned around and said, actually, it's internal. I realise now that I was going on that path, but isn't my path. Yeah. And so what they actually said is, I'm going to quit, but we have a really nice conversation literally today. And we talked about change, and this change the choose, and this change is chosen for us. And then sometimes we have to respond, especially sort of change that, you know, thrust upon us. Yeah. And that's what that person has now done. And now they're a piece of it, actually a piece so they haven't Quit in a temper. And they haven't quit going, I hate you I hate this place. It's actually really nice. And they're going to find their new path. Yeah, which might bring maybe take them back to a place they were before that. And that's absolutely cool. And realistic to think that you're going to have 40 year service and a gold watch and things like that, in the modern era. So anyway, I said, that's just a couple of anecdotes. So I bet you've got something to come back on report.
Yeah, no, I mean, I think sort of. So that first point of things, being in a universal balance, but it is an individual imbalance is so so true. And it's one of the things that it's just a fact of life, but where we make it harder for ourselves and where the world tells us we have how the world makes it harder for us is this idea of, and I hate the phrase so much, because it's just total bullshit is work life balance. First of all, there's no separation between work and life, work is part of your life and your life you bring into your work, so there's no separation at all. So even the idea of having balance between the two suggests that there is a separation, which there isn't. But secondly, this idea that balance is the goal is also just unrealistic. Life is all about managing the sort of teetering and tottering of what it means to be human. But in the bigger picture, where there's been a skew over time, that will rebalance itself. It's just not in any one instance. So for example, I know that I have certain things that I care about fundamentally and I value and big picture, its health, like my personal physical and physical and nutritional health, it's family, and it's my work because my work helps me make an impact, positive impact. Now, at any given moment, I'm doing pretty well on one, and okay on another and really shit a third. And I know that that's just how it is because I am one person with a finite amount of time, energy, you know, resources, headspace, all that kind of stuff. And if I told myself, I had to balance it all perfectly, I drive myself crazy, I'd get really frustrated, I put unrealistic demands on myself, and it just wouldn't work. And what I do very consciously, instead is say, you know, what, I know, this is the one thing that I'm going to let slide for now. So in the present moment, where I am much more focused on my family, because I've got a one year old daughter and a four year old and you know, there's a lot of, there's just a lot I don't want to miss, excuse me, and a lot that I thank you and a lot that I want to be present for. And also in my work, you know, there's been some really wonderful momentum that's building that I don't want to stop. And so my physical fitness I have consciously chosen to put on the backburner. Of course, I make sensible choices. In the interim anyway, it's not like I've turned from, you know, eating salads to eating crisps and nothing else. But you know, it's again, consciously choosing that that is not going to get the best of me at the moment. And that's okay. And then when the tables are a little bit different, when my kids are a little bit older, maybe less, or whatever else it is, then maybe I can dial it up on my sort of refocusing on my health, and never, ever letting any one of those things totally go. But choosing which one is going to get less of my priorities. And it really is just about making those choices very consciously, instead of forcing ourselves to try to unrealistically perfect them, because that's what people always are talking about, when they talk about balance, they're never talking about actual balance, they're talking about perfection about whatever standard they've created for themselves, or that has been foisted on them. And to get it all right, well, I'm sorry, that's just not going to happen. So take that as a fact of life, because it is, and then make your choices very, very specifically and very consciously about what you're going to let slip and what you're going to focus on. I think that, you know, is a really big part of it. And then it also ties into this idea that you raised about change. Again, it's that inevitability that things will change. And as you said, so well, sometimes it's changed that we choose, sometimes it's changed that is foisted upon us, but we have to choose how we are going to respond to that change. And we all have that choice. We can choose to, you know, the example you raised earlier, we can choose to be gracious about it and see it as an opportunity for growth or reflection or introspection. Or we can throw our toys out of the pram and say no, this is you know, I'm going to sort of scream into the wind and fight this, even though it's the fight, I can't win. And so again, being conscious about the battles we're choosing, being thoughtful about the choices we're making, is all we can ever do. And it's that's part of what it is to be a grown up and to be a human being. And so it's you know, it's it's nice to talk about these things in very sort of profound big picture ways. But at the end of the day, we are all Making choices. And the difference between, you know, those of us who are having these kinds of conversations is that we're doing them consciously instead of letting them be made for us.
Very good. Very points well made, I could come back on so many of you said it so eloquently. I don't need to I don't think so. But one thing I do think I would like to dwell on a little bit there is the idea you're saying about, you know, we're, we're whole person. So how can you split and be imbalanced? And things like that? So I totally get that. Absolutely. And then you talk about, you know, making choices, and then conscious choices to either let that sort of physical exercise thing go because you've got other priorities now, and that's cool. But just Roopa? Let me ask you this question. Yeah. Were you born with that way of thinking? Did you get some top software plugin, waking up one day with an epiphany? And how did you realise that, you know, that it just,
it's so no, I definitely did not wake up with any sort of download that, that others weren't given. For me, it's been an evolution and, and, you know, I'm, I'm a nerd apart. So I love to learn, I love having conversations with people, I love drawing on random sources for inspiration and information. And, you know, I'm an avid reader, but I'm also an avid thinker. And so, I would say, all of these, perhaps, you know, maybe more introspective and reflective, and maybe even philosophical points that we've just discussed, and things that I've started to realise, I've only really been thinking about for the better part of the past 10 years. So I spent the first, you know, three fourths of my life to aid yourself.
I just did, but I don't think anyone's going to do the math for you know, effectively for the first you know, three or four years of my life just being, you know, sort of, I wouldn't say a typical human, but doing the thing of like, you know, not really, not really being, too. How can I say it, I guess not being conscious of a lot of the things that I'm now conscious of. So I've always, I've always been enabled, gays are part of what being a nerd looks like, for me is that I've always been somewhat introspective, and somewhat sort of what does it all mean? And, and that's part of what has fueled my, my, my passion for just learning and drawing on different sources. But actually taking that knowledge, and then using it and filtering it and finding ways to make it applicable to my life, I haven't really done a good job of, until the past 10 years or so. And so, yeah, as I said, it's an evolution, it's, it's been something that again, sort of like what we were talking about earlier, I've just sort of followed the leads and followed the interesting trails, or I've had a conversation with someone who's recommended a book, and then I've read another book, you know, it's again, it's been, it's that open mindedness and, and that creativity, or not creative curiosity, both about the world, but also about myself, and how I operate, and then trying to understand how can I, you know, sort of operate at my best, how can I, you know, tap or tap into more of my potential or even test to see what it is and that kind of thing. And so, yeah, it's been a slow, but I guess, steady process, but really very focused and conscious. Yeah, for only for about the past decade or so.
Yeah, brilliant, I think so many things again, come out of that. And I was just reflecting because, you know, you're, I would call I'm a lifelong learner, I, you know, whatever language you use, you know, your, your, you use the word curious. And I think that's such an important word. Because if you're curious, then you will just follow those little breadcrumb trails. And then it's amazing what you can discover. And if you've got that philosophy, or that attitude of lifelong learning, or personal growth, that's what can get you to these places that we're talking about. But I was trying to illustrate the point that it wasn't, it isn't, you know, use the whole software download. Because it isn't like that. And, Raj, when you talk about evolution, and evolution is not necessarily a straight line. Now. First of all, it's not necessarily without its struggles, either. So I think, you know, that's just me reflecting back a little bit on that, just to say that, you know, I'm not gonna reveal any of our, you know, deeper conversations, but you know, it hasn't always been plain sailing. It hasn't. We're all about stuff. So, I think having that consciousness having, making a deliberate choice, not what's important, I think, is the key takeaway there and change will happen whether we wanted or,
exactly. And Richard, I mean, to be honest, for me, there are two fundamental things that I that always sort of, that I always keep in the forefront. First and foremost is I am really freakin lucky. So yes, you know, you and I have had lots of conversations offline about very specific challenges and obstacles and difficult periods. And all, you know, my life has not been, as you said, plain sailing, and most people's aren't right, we all face challenges and obstacles and difficult periods and downtimes in different degrees and in different ways. And so that is a very, again, human experience. And it's not something that I have somehow managed to float above. But I know that, fundamentally, I am a lucky human being, because I have my health, I have people I love and who love me. And in the grand scheme of things, I have a really damn good life, I don't have you know, I have food on the table, I have a warm, you know, warm shelter, and, and people who love me. And so that reality is something that we always take for granted. And it's something that I have chosen to not take for granted, and to see for what it is, which is the biggest blessing ever, you know, and it's not something to take lightly. And it is something that is just, you know, helps me keep perspective on any of those times when I am feeling down or low or worried or anxious or going through a tough spot. Yes, the challenges are there, they're always going to be there. But fundamentally, my life is really, really good. And it's, it's safe. And it's and it's comfortable. You know, I hate to take things back to like the global political sort of arena. But like, you know, we don't live in Afghanistan. We don't live in Syria, we don't live in hundreds of other countries around the world where just day-to-day living is a struggle. And so fundamentally, we're all really damn lucky. If you can have time and the luxury to be able to listen to a podcast, then you're doing pretty well, you know, pretty well for yourself. So that's one thing. And then the second thing is, in a non depressing way, I'm also very conscious of how damn short life is. And that book 4000 weeks? Well, we were Yeah, exactly 4000 weeks on average. And at this point in my life, I've effectively cut through half of them, right. So I'm very aware that time is running out. But it's, you know, my time on this planet is finite. And I want to make sure that I don't waste it to the, to the extent that I can, I don't want to waste it in any capacity, I don't want to waste it, you know, being unhappy, I don't want to waste it, not doing things that I can do or not experimenting, I don't want to waste it, just doing the same thing over and over again. And so for me, curiosity, creativity and engagement are really, really important. And so again, anytime there is this sense of like, oh, this is a tough patch, or you know, this is really hard at the moment, or whatever, I always force myself to remember like, this is your one shot, what are you going to do to get through this so that you can then meet the next challenge, and you can then have another story to tell and you can then you know, keep going. But you know, those two things being really lucky, which we all are all of your listeners are in some really fundamentally important ways. But also not wasting the time that we've got obsessing over the problems, obsessing over the negatives, and just getting shit done and doing our thing and getting it effectively sort of getting out of our own way to do it. Because time will be will be gone before we know it.
Yeah, and as humans, you know, the whole Maslow's needs hierarchy, basic, you know, food, shelter, security, etc. that you've just highlighted. So well, there's lots of places in the world that don't have, you know, those bases you're living in, you know, and I think, you know, first world problems, right, we were listening to, we're talking on the podcast, you know, laptops and phones all around us and stuff. And, you know, my Skype went off earlier in the call, and I was like, a little bit irritating. But it's a first world problem is going off on my laptop when I'm recording a podcast with my buddy. So I'm not worried about a bullet in my back. Or, you know, something like that, or, you know, it could be a tennis player in China or something.
I know. Well, and look, first of all problems are still problems, right? So there's the thing like, yes, it's important to have perspective, but also your realities, your reality. So of course, it's going to feel more important and bigger and, and more meaningful and whatever else. And that's always going to be true, and that's fine. But my point is then to flip that on its head and say, Look, this is a first world problem. I live in a quick, you know, quote, unquote, the first world like, I have no excuse to not make whatever it is out of my life that I wanted to be so I have, you know, no excuse not to learn all the things, do all the things be all the things that I think I want to be or at least explore, because I have that luxury, you know, if we don't take advantage of our privilege and not advantage in an extractive a negative way, but If we don't, you know, use our privilege for everything that has given us to live the self-actualized lives or whatever you want to call it, then what a waste. You know, why don't we're just throwing it out the window, these first-world conditions that we find ourselves in, we're really lucky, we have no excuse to not make the most of our lives.
Absolutely. And I think, you know, we talked about the opportunity side of you know, where we are, and even if you happen to be listening to this in a developing country, or something that, hopefully, because you're listening to this, you have certain opportunities, as well. And I think the other side of it, you did actually touch on, I don't know, if we've got a deputy still with me, Rupert, by the way, is, yeah, just checking this. First of all problem with the other side of you, he did touch on it, which, which was being grateful for what we do, and just recognizing that, and you will sort of mentioned about just sort of being in the moment and enjoying that. Because by the way, which you did say on average, 4000 weeks, everybody knows 4000 weeks, you know, so that's another thing to keep in mind, a sense of perspective. So, you know, live, live the day, seize the day, etc. It doesn't mean we necessarily have to go, go, go, go, go-go, because, but, you know, just make the most of what we have, and enjoy the journey and the ride. Yeah,
and also knowledge, the little things that, you know, the luxuries, we have to be annoyed at Skype or zoom or whatever. And, and, you know, this is perhaps maybe too personal and insight, but I often get so irritated at my husband for leaving soapsuds on the dishes, when before he you know, before he puts them on the drying rack, and it annoys me to no end. And I always remind myself, be thankful that you have a husband to be irritated at right? Be thankful that he is a healthy partner in my life, who's willing to do that, you know, all of these little things that we get irritated that it comes up in that 4000 weeks book, actually, at one point where, you know, this, this, one of the people cited in the book is talking about how they lost a friend suddenly to cancer. And anytime that person is that in traffic, they're like, You know what, this friend who passed away from cancer wouldn't give to be stuck in traffic. You know, it's like the little irritations that we experience in our lives. Again, we're lucky enough to be alive to experience them. So at least be thankful for that.
Certainly, it's funny, I happened to be looking at Facebook earlier. And I hasten to add, I don't spend a lot of time these days, thankfully. But it was it was my niece's birthday. So thank you, Facebook, for reminding me about my niece's birthday. So that's one of the useful things that Facebook, I'd send her a little message obviously stimulated by that notification. And now I kind of was in you know, there was a scrolling little thing that's just for a few minutes report, I'm sure you won't judge too much. To her there was a must, must follow this page, you've got a nice full power positivity or something, or maybe somebody shared it from that page. And so it's called The Power of positivity. But the the little banner or quote or question that they pose was, what is a non-negotiable are not acceptable in a partner or something to that effect. Which, by the way, didn't think was very positive. Yeah, but I just had a little scuffle this, I just wonder what people are writing. And it was like, Oh, my Goodness me. You know, how did anybody ever choose me? You know, I mean, you know, to be a partner. I mean, I probably leave soapsuds on the dishes. But I'm quite pleased, because the I think one of the two things that seem to pop up a lot were bad hygiene. Yeah. Yeah. And, and being unkind. Yeah. to people and animals actually falling out. So I think I'll pass those two tests most. So, you know, that's probably what you know, my wife sees me, I'm sure. If we do lose the sense of perspective, some people have lists, this can't be that can't be the other. I'm like, and then for somebody if somebody had a list, and they finished it, oh, now I realise why I'm single. always drawn into it. Then I caught myself because obviously, I knew the algo was kind of work. Could have been sucked in and I bet you know, I'm gonna see a load of power positivity. Yeah, you are gonna feed you know. Anyway, thanks, Facebook, but I'll leave it there. So, I think I really wanted to get into a little bit of you, you just dropped it in in the beginning, because you said I like to speak a lot and I like to write a lot, you know, and I know you're also doing some work with mentor coaching, you know, that sort of thing. If I got the three, kind of Yeah. So just, you just dropped a bomb on me before we went Live? Yeah. You told me about your book. Can I just say, I just want you to talk about it a little bit? Yeah. It's a blatant plug. Well, yeah, maybe it is. But whatever I don't want us to talk about, well, first of all, tell us what it is and when. And let's just talk about the process and how that came about and everything.
So the book is called from CIA to CEO, unconventional life lessons for thinking bigger, leading better and being bolder. And it is going to be published with a big UK publisher in a few months time, it's already available for pre order on Amazon. So anyone shameless plug here, please go check it out and preorder it. But the book is effectively that you know, the subtitle about thinking bigger, leading better and being bolder, it's a distillation of all of the things that I've learned that I've developed, that I've come up with, for myself and for others, around those three, three sort of topics. And it is another perfect example of sort of, following the leads, tuning into your intuition and just being open minded and willing to explore. So way back when I mean, literally way back, when, from the ages of when I was maybe five or six years old, I've always loved to write, I've always written I've always enjoyed the process of perfectly capturing an idea or, or a setting or, or anything, I just love the intellectual stimulation and the power of words. So I've always written. And it's always been a lifelong goal for me to write a book, and to publish a book, not just write one. And so again, sort of in the, I would say, past 10 or so years now, I started to finally get serious about it. I've always written in some capacity personally, and always in some capacity through my profession. But finally starting to get serious about it. So back in 2013, I think I wrote a fiction book. And it was a fictionalised account of my time in the intelligence services, and was effectively an homage to, to my career at the CIA, to the people and the friendships that I developed there. And it was, I wrote it right after I had left the agency and was transitioning into this private sector business world. And it felt like the right time. And so I thought that was my book, that was the one that was going to be published. And so I did all the things, I reached out to agents, and I wanted to publish it traditionally. And then, you know, whether you believe in the sort of metaphysics of it or not, effectively the Muse just last week, and I had gotten it to the point where I had two different agents, who were potentially interested in representing me and this book, but they wanted me to make some edits. And I just, I didn't have it in me. And it wasn't the work that was required. It was this again, I'll say metaphysical because I don't know what else it can be. It just, it felt like the muse, the passion, the story wasn't there anymore. And it was there physically, there was a book, but it wasn't in me anymore. So that just collected dust. And it's still there collecting sort of published, it's not been published. And so, so that would, but again, it served a purpose, I guess, going again, full circle, it served a purpose. And that it, you know, it was a tribute to my friends who I made while I was there was a tribute to my career to the work that I did, and to the experiences that I had. And it served that purpose, but not necessarily or at least not to date, the one of publishing anyway, so you know, but I kept writing and I did follow the leads, didn't know where it was gonna go, I, you know, started writing a blog that nobody read, because I didn't tell anybody about it, started writing a blog that I did tell people about, and they started reading it and you know, I get feedback and all this great stuff. And then I started writing magazine articles and, and, and so it was just being open to the opportunity to write for its own sake, because I loved doing it because I thought I had useful ideas and value to share with others. And then probably it all started to crescendo, again, maybe two to three years ago where I felt like okay, I've got a book, I've got a book, I don't know what it is, but I've got a book and again, following the breadcrumb trail, you know, being open all that great stuff. And then finally, it got so that that sort of feeling or that momentum, so almost physically painful that I was like, Okay, I have to make this happen. And it wasn't anything that I again sort of preordained and was like, This is what it's going to be about and this is where it's going blah, blah, blah. It was an evolution, you know, and it was a bit meandering. But I sat down and then finally started to take it seriously, just take this project to take the book and what it could be and what?
yeah. So yeah. So finally, it got to a point where I couldn't ignore it anymore. It was that that energy was almost physically bursting forth. And, and so I, you know, I started to think about, well, what is one of the messages I want to put out there. And I realized that a lot of the work that I was doing one on one with leaders or founders or just unofficially, as a mentor, or, you know, in conversations I was having with friends, and it was these three, big three topics, you know, getting people to develop a bigger mindset, thinking bigger, leadership comes up a lot, obviously, in business settings, and how you can be a better leader and in a nontraditional sense, be a better leader. And then this idea of being bolder in all aspects of our lives, because that was one of the journeys that I went on was, you know, going from being, I guess, much more limited in what I thought I would achieve, not what I could achieve, but what I would achieve. And to finally realising Well, actually, I can, pretty much we all can make pretty much anything happen, if we just try and use it, there's not it's not that simple. But you know, there's, there's a way to do it. And so, so that's what I started doing is, you know, I sat down and I did all the structured stuff, I you know, I worked with some really wonderful people to help me make the ideas coherent, and give them a structure. And, and then again, it was one of those beautiful things of it just all started to fall into place. So one of the people that I was working with, who's a common contact of ours, Richard, she introduced me to someone who then introduced me to my now literary agent, and my literary agent was the one who then went around and shopped my book around to various publishers. And we had in the end, five offers actually five author offers from big publishing companies. And we went with, you know, the, the one we went with now, which is Bonnie a UK. And it was, you know, in many ways, it was just, the momentum had finally built, and the stars were starting to align. And it was, of course, I did the work, I laid the foundation, all that great stuff. But, you know, it's that idea that you make your own luck. And if I hadn't done any of those things, you know, the outcome would have potentially been totally different. But I was willing to just ride the ride, and then jump on the opportunities as they presented themselves. And, and so now we have a book that's available on Amazon, and it's gonna be published in a few months.
I'm really pleased you just shared so much of that story. And I know it isn't the full story. But even now, but I think I'm so pleased that you did because it takes us through a cycle and a journey. I didn't actually know you'd written that first book or didn't remember me, you had told me and I couldn't remember. But, by the way, when we're talking about publishing a book, I mean, I'm just about to launch my third book. Yeah. Yeah. And hopefully not too far away. But I'm self publishing. Okay. And you've got like a full on big dog, you know, publishing deal. And I think money change hands and things like that. So yeah. And I remember when we were first connecting, you were talking about your book, idea and project and it was, you know, it was a vision, a goal. A dream. Yeah. Passion. Yeah. I don't believe you had any words on paper at that point. Now, it didn't.
You know, it's interesting, Richard, because I think so many of us do this thing of wishing for stuff. We say, Oh, I wish I could do this. Or I wish I could do that. And, and again, as can do as I am, I found myself doing that with my book. And I'd often say, oh, gosh, you know, I want to write a book. And it was, you and a few other people who asked the very obvious question, well, what's it about? And when are you going to start writing it? And it sounds so obvious because it is, but too often we do this right? We take these big dreams and big ambitions or small dreams and small ambitions that we just keep them very theoretical and amorphous. And we say, Oh, I wish and then we think that's enough where we leave it at that, but everything again, is eminently doable and eminently possible, but you just have to start doing it. And so it was that question of well, what's it about? You know, what, when are you going to start writing it that finally gave me that nudge? To say, okay, yes, I need some accountability here, I'm not going to just do it on my own, because I haven't done it to a point. And I need someone to help me with the structure. I know generally what it's going to be about. But, you know, I know where my sort of weak points are in the creative process, and it's in the structure and it's in the accountability. And so, I work with someone who gave me both of those things, you know, gave me homework, gave me deadlines gave me all of that great stuff to get the ball rolling. Again, I did all of the work, but I had someone helped me along the way, a wonderful person who just got me going, and, and if that hadn't happened, then the book wouldn't have happened, right? It's not that I'm all of a sudden, somehow more capable and more, you know, a more qualified author. You know, because I have a book deal. No, I'm the same person. It's just I actually did the work to make the book a reality. And so you know, it's some it is sometimes we are again, the our own worst enemies by keeping these goals and these ambitions to theoretical when sometimes all we need is a kick up the backside by some very, very kind and very supportive friends, but then also the actual practical, you know, support coaching, whatever it is of someone to just get us to get shit done and get it out there.
Yeah, so much good stuff that I'm going to just read something to you that I read on social media this morning fessing up, this isn't this is now on LinkedIn. So I've been on Facebook and LinkedIn already today. So I better watch out. But this one's probably a little bit more, I think more valuable than the power prosumer or whatever it was positivity one that I referred to earlier. Do you recognize it? So I'm just going to read it. Do you recognise? It says affirmation without discipline is the beginning of illusion.
Yes, or should I put that out there? It's not mine. It's Jim Rohn. But it's, yeah, I shared that at a LinkedIn post. Whatever it was, yeah.
But the point about so affirmation, you know, manifestation and vision, visioning. And you know, all that stuff, wanting something and wanting outcome. But the obviously this, the other side of that coin, is the one you were kind of alluding to, and that's what reminded me. Discipline, and discipline can come from within, and if you maybe don't quite have enough of it, but maybe it can also come from without
100% 100%. You know, I think, you know, again, going back to this bigger picture stuff, but also so yeah, so I worked with a book coach, because she gave me the homework, the deadlines, the accountability, the structure, all of that great stuff. And, you know, similarly, you and I offline, were talking about, you know, Jessica Ennis Hill, she didn't become an Olympic heptathlete on her own Yes, for capability was always there. Yes, she did all the work in the training, but she worked with some damn good coaches to help her get out of her own way to give her the structure, the accountability, the tips, the tweaks, all that great stuff. And it's that combination of innate ability that is then, you know, sort of just helped along the way. Again, nobody else is doing the work for you. But it's helping it out making it that much better making the tweaks providing, you know, the various external things, whether it is, you know, discipline or structure or whatever that some of us might need help getting and that's fine. You still did the work right. Just Hill isn't any less of a heptathlete because she has a coach that if she tried to do it on her own, if anything, she is a heptathlete because she did have a coach and did have both so so yeah, we often overcomplicate it when the answers are, are sometimes really obvious. And the support is really easily available. And we just make it harder than it needs to be. So yeah, I'm glad you brought that up, Richard, that combination of the affirmation, yes, have the self belief, have the vision have the goal, but you need to pair that with the discipline of action of a very targeted and specific action and just keep on doing it.
You got to do the work. I mean, you get things done really well for you right now, for example, and you're blessed when grateful and humble with it, too. I know you are. But we were sort of speculating how many years it was before you became an overnight success. You know, we didn't settle on the exact timeline, but you know, people see all of that necessarily just see oh, you know, okay, big, big deal. She's a big shot. She's got a book deal, blah, blah, blah. Yeah, it was just Russell's a struggle. I think that's almost a because you said was it 2013 When you wrote the first book, which we'll never see,
maybe who knows. I don't know. My editor and my agent are sort of keen to at least even the manuscript in its current sort of unfinished state because No, maybe there is something in it. Who knows? There might be there might not be but at the end of the day, yeah, it's there. So, you know, like I said it served a purpose, it might end up serving a different or additional purpose as well.
Everything has its time and its place. But there was another thing I just couldn't help. Going back to this. There's two things I want to say. The first is you come early, we're talking about return on investment. And then we talked, I alluded to return on time, but flip to the time freedom that we had way back now. And but the other one, I'm looking at my whiteboard, because I'm going to do some writing about Yes, I've written down ROI, R O T. And the third is aro E. And you've probably guessed is energy. Energy. Absolutely. Well done for Chewning. return on energy, and I think, you know, so we sometimes we running low energy, or it's not that we're not placing in the right direction, and things happen, you know, you kind of illustrate that pretty well with the contrast, perhaps between the two books. So people should draw on that. The other thing I just want to say, and I hope I can keep it together as I say this, because I'm reminded actually, that, you know, there's a saying that everybody's got a book in them. Yeah. My father said that about himself. He passed away before he wrote his and, and you know, funnily enough, Dan Hill, who was also on the podcast couple of weeks ago, referred to another quotation, which I also love, which is don't die. Don't die with a music suicide of you. Yeah. Something to that effect. Yeah. And so, you know, it was a small tribute to my father, when I wrote my first little book, because he didn't manage to get his out. And in fact, you know, he, he could see the incoming, I won't go into too much detail, but he could see the time. And then he was even going to start and, you know, he was there, he had a little notebook, and he was gonna start doing it. And it's just it was an unfinished manuscript. So I don't know if that was, you know, I don't know, for he didn't publish it. And he didn't write it. And I think, you know, I just want to tell you, I've taken that as a as a life lesson. Yeah. If you if you feel it's right, and it's inside of you. Love you have a good go.
Yeah, definitely.
It's not criticism of my father. No, no. Inspiration, in many ways. So yeah, and,
you know, as you said, you know, everyone has a book in them. But sometimes that book might be a song, or that book might be a business, or that book might be a legacy of a different kind, you know, it doesn't have to be an actual book, it just, it's that thing of, you know, what is inside of you, you know, if you ever stopped the running around, and the putting out fires to tune into yourself what it is that wants to come out. Or it might even just be an inkling of something that wants to come out. And then again, you sort of follow the lead, and you see where it goes and ride that ride. But it's, um, yeah, we all have something, you know, and it doesn't have to be on a grand scale, it doesn't have to be on any scale, it just has to be meaningful for you. And for you to feel like you brought something of yourself from within yourself into the world in some capacity. And for some people that might be their children. For some people, like I said, that might be a physical song, or a physical book, or some other way of bringing something out from within. But yeah, I mean, we all do, human beings are nothing if not creative, just by our very nature. And creative doesn't mean you know, artistic or literary or any of those things. It's we create things we create on a daily basis. We create ideas, we create stuff, we create relationships, and so it's whatever that quote unquote, book looks like for you bring it out.
Yeah, well bring it out. Absolutely. So I think So yours is coming out. I think you can pre order as you say, is it?
Yeah, so yeah, so it's coming out in May of 2022. But yeah, you can pre order it now. If you're willing to wait a few months for it.
I'm gonna try. I'm gonna do that, by the way. Wonderful. Thank you, by the way, I think authors need to get, you know, the credit and you know, for their work, so I always buy books, you know, and sometimes somebody sometimes some people do send them to me or give to me, but I don't ask, but I will buy it. I will link in the show notes. And I'm sure, by the way, you know, he can probably tell just by listening to report, the show, the book is going to be amazing, right? Your your thought processes, the depth and the breadth of your knowledge, your vocabulary, your sensitivity to different things, you know, it's gonna be a really good read. I wouldn't have any hesitation. I'm not just picking it up because you're there on the other side. conversation. I can't actually see you right now because obviously you turn the video Hello. Yeah, maybe I've made you blush a little bit No, no, I'm probably I think, just to keep keep the book theme a little bit. So yes, the next chapter Rupo what's the next chapter? Not literally?
Yeah. You know, I think there are more books actually in me. They're speaking of tributes. Um, there's a way that I would haven't figured out what it's going to look like yet, but I would love in some capacity to. And I hope I hold it together now. To pay tribute to my, my family and, and my lineage. And, you know, I said earlier about how I am so fundamentally lucky. And I know I hit the jackpot of life being born into my family. And, and I learned such an incredible amount from my parents, first and foremost, but my grandparents who I was lucky enough to have lived with us for most of my life. I mean, I all four of my grandparents were with me until I was in my 20s. And one grandparent is now she's in her 90s. And she's still here. And so I had such a, again, a breadth and a wealth of wisdom, that I just grew up around passively. And so much of who I've become a, you know, upon reflection, has, of course, been moulded and shaped by my experience, and my family, as you know, it is for all of us. But there's, there's so much more than that, that is universal, that I'd love to share with the world and in some capacity. So I think, you know, it's not just gonna be a tribute to my family, and like, this is how amazing everyone is. And as with all families, we've had, you know, we've got our quirks that are maybe darker side. But yeah, to encapsulate it somehow I think there's, there's definitely something there. So yeah, I think that's one of the projects that I'm you know, I'm really excited about thinking through, and I'm lucky again now to have, you know, the support from a publisher and an agent who will help me make something really wonderful from, you know, some of the various book ideas I've got. So, yeah, I'm actually on the hook to have an initial chat about what the next book is going to be like. So that's exciting. Yeah. Um, and then Richard, I don't know what, you know, I would love to just keep doing more of what I'm doing. But I also know that, you know, the world is an interesting and ever changing place. And so I'm happy to just see where things go, you know, I don't like to plan or, or make definitive statements about anything other than, you know, I know, fundamentally, that whatever I do is going to have a large element of giving back of helping other people of indulging my curiosity and my creativity. And, and let's just see how it goes and where it goes from here.
Fantastic. Well, I mean, you still got a podcast, right? Do you?
Yeah, it's on hold at the moment, I'm not doing any more live, or not doing any more new episodes until after the book is launched, just because that's that is taking up quite a lot of my creative energy. But it but it's still there that the back catalogue, has some fantastic people on it. It's really, really wonderful conversations. And then yeah, I'm planning on sort of relaunching it in a few months.
Are you doing something to keep the momentum going in while you're taking a break? From
the podcast? Yeah, sorry. Yeah, no, I mean, I'm just reminding people that it's there.
Okay, well, maybe, maybe not for now. But if you listen in maybe next week, because yeah, Shiggy, who does my podcast production? And he's absolutely amazing. And kind of a bit bonkers at times. But we had a really good conversation about that. And this is all the reason why these chats have come about is it's a bridge between the old podcast and new podcast, and she's got some ideas about how the bridge can be built and extended. The podcast can still be there, even though I'm not necessarily there on hardware that share that with you offline. But I just wanted to go back to the family quickly, because I know we're with a time element. But I can't leave this conversation about something you said. You said your father, what do you say your father said?
Yeah, he's well, yeah, he's he's given me lots of pearls that, you know, I didn't register at the time and only now with some sort of reflection and wisdom of age, I guess. But when I think I was in college, so you know, late teens, early 20s, when he said to me, and I cannot remember the context, but he's like Ruby, you know, there will be times in your life where no matter what you do, everything will go wrong. And there will be times in your life where no matter what you do, everything you touch will turn to gold. And that has been such a strangely reassuring And true sort of prediction to the extent that he meant it to be. But what I find so liberating about it in some counterintuitive ways that no matter what you do part, so sometimes, actually, all the times, we cannot control the outcome, we just do what we do, and we try our best, and we give it a go and all that great stuff. But regardless, sometimes we'll fall flat on our faces or the world will shut us down or shut us out or, or other times, we'll do the same thing. And it'll all of a sudden, you know, turn into this beautiful, amazing thing. But there is an element of just real reassurance in that, you know, it just yeah, like I said, just focus on doing you doing what you do doing it with integrity, with honesty, with your values as a compass, all that, you know, wonderful sort of stuff. And then just in a, I guess, almost like a Zen slash Buddhist way, you know, let go of the obsession of knowing what the outcome is going to be and trying to force it because it's not, you know, sometimes again, no matter what you do,
yeah, it's a kind of, what's your father's name? I want to give him credit, cuz I'm going to use that quotation
and just go for it. His name is Yogendra. Oh, okay. Yeah,
I might need to, just to check the spelling. Yeah, of course. I would love to give him the credit for that. Yeah. And I think it's a really fitting way, I was going to come back with a couple of other bits, but we're, we've clocked the time group, or would you be surprised? Yeah, we've kind of maybe done slightly a little bit more. What a shock with you. And I, I could, I could literally keep talking. And maybe we will after after we start. This is a good time maybe to draw a line anything. And that quotation that you saying, you know, and you're in a good phase right now where, you know, most whatever you're doing is going well, then, you know, you're grateful for it. And it's, and it's well deserved. And after a lot, a lot, a lot of hard work and creative energy. So, you know, don't underestimate what it takes to get to the place. But equally, if there were times where it was maybe dark, it wasn't so good. You know that's, you know, that's going to happen, but that it will pass as well. So, exactly. Thank you so much report. I mean, I really enjoyed our conversation. We didn't know where it was going to go. Exactly. Yeah. We, we just have a lot of fun. I have a lot of fun. Me too. Okay, good. Well, I didn't want to make any assumptions. And hopefully, the audience has got a lot out of it. And if they want to connect with you recall, what would be the easiest way right now?
Yeah, just go to my website. It's ripple y patel.com. Easy enough. And I, you know, contact me through that I always respond. And yeah, I'd always, you know, be I'm always open to connecting with folks.
And you're well worth connecting to. So thanks again. I'm just going to do the quick outro. And really, you know, thanks so much for coming, joining me in the sort of internet or Rianne. During conversations. I didn't know what they were going to lead to my pleasure, common threads, which I might reflect on, by the way. Cool. Yeah. But anyway, that's sort of see how it all goes. So here we go. Thanks very much for listening once again this week to the proxy wars podcast with my guest, Rupert Patel. And the show notes are going to be over the website, the property voice.net If you want to connect with me or talk about anything from today's show, or you can't remember Rupert's email address. So website, you can connect with me podcasts at the bottom voice.net and I pass it on to you. There's going to be some links in the show notes. Guess what, they'll be a book link probably. And that website and you know the I'm going to credit your father with that beautiful quotation there. So thanks very much for listening once again this week, and until next time on the property boys podcast, just catch up
Transcribed by https://otter.ai